What to Do When You Suddenly Lose Your Job - Ep. 32

Ryan: Hello. Aloha guys. And welcome back to the degree free. We are your hosts, Ryan, and Hannah Maruyama. On this podcast, we share fundamentals that we discovered at the mistakes we've made, while self-educating getting work, building businesses and making money. We'll tell you how to make it happen. No degree needed.

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Ryan: Yep. degreefreenetwork.com. And also the links are in the videos.

If you're watching this on YouTube, and then if you haven't already please like, and subscribe to the podcast and share this episode, if you find it useful. And with all that being said, let's get into today's episode today. We are going to be talking about what to do when you suddenly lose your job.

Hannah: Or find out you're about to.

Ryan: Right. Exactly. And this is something that. Is kind of happening all the time. Unfortunately.

Hannah: This is usually how it goes. Most people have, like, I mean, I had two weeks notice that most, if any.

Ryan: If any, I know what is right now with COVID and everything like that. And certain restrictions, depending on where you live and you know, and all of that, there's.

You know, you can lose your job really abruptly, or they're giving you a couple of weeks notice or something like that.

Hannah: Or did you hear about that better.com company that fired all like fired like hundreds of employees on a zoom call with no notice, like last week, that was pretty crazy. They got, they did not get any notice.

They just, they were just out in the cold. So it happens. It happens to people.

Ryan: This is something. That is definitely, unfortunately, something that has happened to you and I, before I'm happened to you multiple times. And these are the things that we did when we lost our jobs. Also sprinkled in with some of the things that we would do now, and we wish that we knew back then.

Hannah: Yeah.

Ryan: Bunch of years ago, we both suddenly lost our job at the same time. And we were not prepared for that to happen.

Hannah: Financially, emotionally.

Ryan: Right.

Hannah: And professionally in any way.

Ryan: In any way. And it was a scramble because we were a two income household and we both lost our job same day and it was tough.

Hannah: It was.

Ryan: Luckily. I did some of the things here and I was able to find a job almost immediately. And you did one of the other things that we're going to talk about.

Hannah: But then we don't recommend off, off the cuff to people that are quitting their job or getting fired right now.

Ryan: Right. But it was a mistake .

Hannah: Yes. I would agree with that statement.

Ryan: Yeah.

Hannah: Yeah.

Ryan: And I would say the conventional wisdom that, that I've been. Hearing or not that I've heard before is that you have time. Right. And especially if you got fired and it was kind of a bad breakup, right? Like it was kind of not an amicable split. I mean, you got fired. Right.

Hannah: Yeah.

Ryan: And so, people are going to tell you, you know, lick your wounds. You have time. Don't worry about it.

Hannah: That's not good advice.

Ryan: I don't think that that is a good way to go about this right now.

Hannah: No.

Ryan: I think contrary to that, it's our, it's our, of our opinion that you don't have time and that the clock is ticking. And the reason why the clock is ticking is that a lot of statistics out there show that you are more likely to get a job, with the job. Then you are to get one while you're unemployed.

Hannah: Yeah. It's harder to explain gaps in your resume and for whatever reason, that's the way that hiring works right now. Why that is? I don't really, I don't really understand. I don't think it's super relevant, but that is still the way the hiring system works.

So if you have gaps in your resume, you basically, what you want to do to set yourself up for success is avoid those in any way possible. So as soon as you get noticed that you are going to lose your job, you need to jump into action.

Ryan: Yeah, definitely. The gaps in the resume. It just doesn't make sense to me right now.

I mean, a lot of people have gaps in their resume. I think life happens, right? I mean, everybody has a life and things happen and you shouldn't have to. It's like be judged because of a lot.

Hannah: It's like, oh, you didn't have a job for three months here. Yeah, and?

Ryan: Right. Exactly.

Hannah: Like it's, it's really strange. I think too, probably it's more, the bigger business that you go to the more that, that's a thing, the smaller business you go to, the less that matters. People, people don't really care,

Ryan: But anyway, that's a discussion for another time. But suffice to say yes, gaps in the resume as it is right now are not good typically. And so that's why that's one of the biggest reasons why we don't have time.

Also, one of the reasons why I say you don't have time is because we talked about it in a previous episode about always being ready to job lift. Right. And in that episode, we kind of talked about always having your resume, ready to go. All right. And if you do have your resume ready to go. Perfect. You know, you, you have like 10% of the battle done.

Hannah: Yeah. Because people can stall for weeks trying to fix my resume. I get it. It's not fun.

Ryan: Right. That being said, one of the first things that you should do. If you find out that you might be losing your job or that you suddenly lost your job, is you need to start not necessarily working on the resume, but what you really need to do is you really need to start summarizing what you do at your job currently.

Hannah: Yeah, and making sure that it's written down in a way that you can easily put into your resume.

Ryan: Exactly. And because it is much easier to look around your current office or your current setup, or look at the tasks that you normally do Monday to Friday, or whenever it is that you work and you say, okay, these are my job duties at this job.

And now you're just listing bullet points rather than taking some time off a week, two weeks a day, whatever it is. Now you're sitting at your computer and you're staring at the blank word doc.

Hannah: And you know, nothing, John's know.

Ryan: Yeah, exactly. And you're just like, what the heck did I used to do with that job?

Hannah: You already forgot. That's why?

Ryan: Yeah. Who knows?

Hannah: Yeah, not me.

Ryan: And it's just going to help you fill out your resume out, at a later time. Much easier. One of the big things too is if, especially if you're in a role where numbers matter. So if you're in a management role where, you know, it's super quantitative. Like

Hannah: You're responsible for overseeing half a million dollars in sales a year,

Ryan: Exactly. And if or a sales role, super quantitative, anything like that, you know, developers with, you know, bugs or you write you underwrite loans, and you're worried about your charge offs, anything like that? You can talk about. The numbers that you have, and you don't have to pull from memory. You don't have to make it up, right?

Because you can actually like run a report of whatever it is that you do. All right. This is what I, I'm in charge of $1.5 million or whatever. It just, it's a good practice to get used to. Ideally, like I said, you already did this. Chances are you didn't and now is the time to act.

Hannah: I think that's probably the best advice is that it's just make sure you're ready, ready for that.

Ryan: If you're staying in the same industry, one of the things, as soon as you find out, it should be really easy to update your resume, right? Because your resume should have the job that you're all redoing or, you know, your resumes should look. Pretty similar throughout. And so now you just have to add a few more bullet points, add this current employer, and then now you're going to want to get out your resume as soon as possible.

Right? I mean, as soon as possible, you find out that you're getting fired on Monday. On Sunday night, you're sending out your resume. You know what I mean? Saturday night, as soon as you find out, you're sending out your resume and that's just going to help you because it takes on average a hundred applications to get one interview.

Hannah: And you don't want to waste time because a lot, what a lot of people do is they're like, well, we'll know, we'll just wait a little bit, do not wait a little bit. If they've, if you've heard whispers of that, or if you've been formally told by a supervisor, just bet that that's going to happen. And then if it doesn't, then you're good to go.

And you ideally have a competing counteroffer to, by the end of that experience, as opposed to. And you didn't use any of that time because out time in between you finding out and you actually being, let go is crucial.

Ryan: And this is kind of a good segue into the next thing, which is you're going to want to reach out to the people in your industry and to your contacts.

I think a lot of people are going to tell you to, kind of keep it hush, hush that you got fired or that you're no longer there or are they downsize or whatever. I think a lot of it has to do with pride.

Hannah: I would agree with that. Cause really you, the only thing that you put at risk there is the risk of you being unemployed when you could have moved faster and possibly had an option.

Ryan: Exactly.

Hannah: Yeah.

Ryan: If you reach out to these contacts, assuming that you have, you know, professional or personal contacts, That are familiar with what you do, then it'd be a lot easier to get a job.

Hannah: Yeah. Word of mouth is the, is one of the easiest ways.

Ryan: 80%. We've said this many times before, but 80% of the job market is filled informally.

Hannah: Yeah. It's estimated that that's how high it is.

Ryan: And

Hannah: It's a lot.

Ryan: Well, if that's true, even if that's not true. Okay.

Hannah: Let's say it's 50%.

Ryan: Let's say it's directionally, right?

Hannah: Sure.

Ryan: Right. 50% or some other number that's large.

Hannah: Yeah. Word of mouth introductions. People who know people.

Ryan: Wouldn't you want to get 80% of the battle dawn immediately.

Hannah: Yes.

Ryan: Exactly.

Hannah: Why would you not?

Ryan: So reach out to, you know, maybe you have a, maybe you have a book of clients. Maybe you have a book of suppliers or vendors or whatever it is that you work with colleagues that work at competing industries or competing companies, rather, maybe you have a really good network of personal friends that atleast know what you do.

And maybe they're not even in the same industry, but they're aware like, oh Ryan, Ryan's in sales, you know, he's in software sales. And even though that, you know, my friend, John, my next door neighbor, John is a plumber. He knows somebody that runs or as a manager or works at a software company. And he's like, oh yeah, well, I know,

Hannah: Janine is hiring.

Ryan: Exactly. How about I connect you too

Hannah: Yeah.

Ryan: And it could be as simple as that.

Hannah: And you never know who knows someone.

Ryan: Exactly.

Hannah: That you need to know.

Ryan: But right now, what we're battling and we've kind of talked about this before is we're battling the average. The average person stays on unemployment for 29 weeks, now.

Hannah: It's a really long time guys.

Ryan: We don't want you to be on unemployment for 29 weeks. We don't want you to be unemployed for that long. You don't want you to be unemployed for that long.

Hannah: Because it's hard. It gets harder for you to find work.

Ryan: The further you get out, the further you don't have a job, the harder it is because of what we were talking about. As erroneous is, we

Hannah: That that stigma is very silly. It's also very real.

Ryan: Yes, exactly.

Hannah: Like, should it be like that? No. Is it like that? Yes. And we can't, we can't live in the world as we'd like it to be. We have to live in the world as it is. And the world, as it is means you need to, you need to get a move on.

You need to shrink that amount of time that you're unemployed as into the smallest amount possible.

Ryan: One of the things,

Hannah: I

I think we all change over time because it's, it's very silly. It's very it not. Human. Right. Because people, people are unemployed all the time.

Ryan: One of the things that I really hate about that is that it's a downward spiral

Hannah: Yeah.

Ryan: And it's just keeps feeding itself.

So, okay. Now I'm unemployed. And then I'm a week unemployed. I interviewed with this guy. He doesn't want to hire me because I haven't had a job for a week. Now, next week I have an interview and I guy doesn't want to hire me because I've had, I haven't had a job for two weeks, so on and so forth and so on and so forth until somebody quote, unquote, takes a chance on you.

Hannah: Right.

Ryan: Right. When it's like,

Hannah: You, weren't a risky employee to begin with. You were just, not an employee for a brief period of time.

Ryan: Exactly.

Hannah: So silly.

Ryan: Yeah.

Hannah: So foolish.

Ryan: And so

reaching out to people and asking for help is going to be one of the quickest ways to get this done. I know from personal experience.

Hannah: Yeah.

Ryan: When we lost our job, when the story in the beginning,

Hannah: When I lost our jobs.

Ryan: Right. That's a story for another time though, but we both lost our jobs at the same time.

Hannah: Yes.

Ryan: And I had, I didn't have any other job prospects. And I knew these guys that sold things on the street. And, you know, one day I was just talking to them, I think it was like the next day or something like that.

They said, oh, come work with us. Okay. And I had a job almost immediately, right. Granted. Okay. It was a sales role. So it was 100% commission.

Hannah: But a job as a job.

Ryan: So there was no. There was no risk as far as bringing me on, because it was 100% commission. I mean, the risk was that,

Hannah: You weren't going to sales as a waste of time.

Ryan: The risk for them was that as a waste of time. Right. I mean, I did get paid a little bit to train

Hannah: Training money.

Ryan: Yeah. Like, you know, enough to buy like a tank of gas,

Hannah: Yeah.

Ryan: that thing. And but anyway, But that's, that is what happened. Right?

Hannah: The point is your gap in employment was like one day,

Ryan: It was a small, because I went to somebody and I just told them what was going on.

Right. And that wasn't really my intention.

Hannah: Yeah.

Ryan: I was really just talking, but through their own volition, they got their own wheels turning

Hannah: Where they go, well,

Ryan: Are they all

Hannah: Work with us.

Ryan: Yeah. Come work with us.

Hannah: Yeah.

Ryan: I like

Hannah: Easy.

Ryan: I know that you can talk. I I've seen you work before. All right. Just come with that. We'll train you to show to do it.

Hannah: And then that's that is, in a small way and it's not like people don't have to be big time movers and shakers. Like you don't need to have parents like Ivy league parents to get introduced to people to get jobs. Like, probably the best people that will help you get jobs to be people that are just working in general.

Like, it doesn't matter what they're doing, really. They just know other people who work. And so they know people that need people to do work because they're doing work. It's, it's really that simple.

Ryan: And then, so what I wanted to say about telling that story was that. When you're telling people, most people want to help you.

Hannah: Yeah.

Ryan: Right. If you say, oh, I lost my job. All I'm kind of in between jobs right now, kind of looking for work, you know, maybe let me know if you, if, if you know anybody.

Hannah: Anybody who you're speaking to, who is listening to you and has asked about your job or is listening to you talk about your job? Yeah. If they're, if they're, if they're at that point in the conversation, they're already flipping in their head to see if they have any suggestions for you. Most people are like that.

Ryan: Exactly.

Hannah: Most people are like that.

Ryan: And now if you ask enough people and I'm not saying to be like, Hey, give me a job. You know what I mean? I'm not telling her like,

Hannah: Whoa is me. I don't have a job to just be like, Hey, if you know of anybody that's hiring, I'm looking for work.

Ryan: Exactly .What type of, what type of work, and you just have a quick elevator pitch,

Hannah: These things but I'll take whatever.

Ryan: Right. Exactly. And that, right there can get you a lot of leads and it might not be as quick as mine. Right, but it could get you to the point where it's like, yeah. Oh, I found out that this company is hiring. Maybe you want to consider. Putting in your resume.

Hannah: Another note is that you may not get an offer, a quick offer for an equivalent job. You should take it anyway. And then as long as you've secured some sort of paycheck, then keep applying in earnest.

Ryan: That is another thing.

Hannah: It's fine guys. I promise it's okay.

Ryan: There's another thing that we wanted to talk about, which is if we know that it's easier to get employed while you have a job,

Hannah: Any job will do.

Ryan: It doesn't have to be your dream job. Just take the employment and then, okay, now you have a job. Now, your back is out of the corner. You don't feel boxed in and so you can operate and make decisions. A little freer,

Hannah: Not out of, yeah, not fighting out of a corner.

Ryan: Exactly.

Hannah: Plus it's way easier to explain a lower paying , a lower paying job than no job.

Ryan: Yeah. Definitely.

Hannah: Employers want to see a job, not no job. It doesn't really matter what it is.

Ryan: I think that might be controversial to be honest.

Hannah: I'm sure people would disagree, but like the, the ATS, the scanning software agrees with me because it flags gaps. It doesn't, it's flagging gaps. You know what I mean? So,

Ryan: And so, what's difficult about that is that now is going to be more difficult. It's going to be harder because now you are learning a new job. You have a new job, so you have less time and you still have to apply.

We didn't say it was gonna be easy.

Hannah: No, but it's far preferable to unemployment.

Ryan: Right. Exactly. At least making some money.

Hannah: You're not fighting an uphill battle,

Ryan: Right.

Hannah: With the, with the future job that you're going to try to get.

Ryan: Exactly.

Hannah: Yeah.

Ryan: It's going to be more difficult. It'd be honest. It'd be more difficult to schedule interviews.

It'll be more difficult to find the energy to just click apply.

Hannah: Yeah, it is. But you still need to do it if you can.

Ryan: And now. One of the things that we wanted to talk about kind of address is going to be like career pivots. This seems like it could be the perfect time for a lot of people to pivot their careers because you suddenly lost your job.

You never would have done it if you hadn't. I'm not saying that the person listening to it, but I'm just saying like in general, It could be the straw that broke the camel's back.

Hannah: Yeah.

Ryan: Right. It could be the push off the cliff or off the ledge that you were looking for in life. And then you were like, well, you know, I'm currently,

Hannah: Might as well ,

Ryan: Yeah. I'm currently a teacher and I just lost my, I just lost my job because of downsizing.

And now I've always really thought about being a coder or programmer, or I've heard that their schedule is better

Hannah: Working in sales.

Ryan: Right. Exactly. I think that this is the perfect opportunity to pivot my career. And I think that is accurate and inaccurate at the same time. It's a very interesting thing.

I think that, yes, I'm glad that you've come to the decision that now is the time because. You've enforced off the cliff. Right. And, but it's bad in that. Okay. A lot of career pivots take time.

Hannah: Yes.

Ryan: And what do we establish when we, at the very beginning, we don't have a lot of time.

Hannah: Right. So, people feel like the unemployment is their time. Like it's my time to learn this. And it's like, yeah, but it's going to be harder to get a job. After you do that.

Ryan: Yeah.

Hannah: For sure.

Ryan: And so was beat with big career pivots. I think it makes sense for the majority of people to get another job and work on their career pivot, on their free time.

Hannah: It may be a good idea to like, if you're going to look for an alternative job, like a standard job while you're pivoting, look for something that doesn't take a lot of emotional energy from you, like look for food you know, something easy, like working at a yogurt shop or something like that.

Something where you don't have to do a lot of like, Emotional mental labor, you know you know, just re restock things, keep stuff clean, go home, study and do your stuff. And I think that that's good advice too.

Ryan: The one, the one thing I will say about that is for a lot of people, if they're losing their job and it's sudden it could be.

That they're getting paid X amount of dollars. Right. And that say, they're getting paid a lot of money or, you know,

Hannah: Maybe slightly different.

Ryan: A good amount of money. And it literally makes to do what you said. Does it make financial sense? Because they're getting paid more in unemployment than they would by stocking shelves for 40 hours a week.

Hannah: Yeah, I guess I'm talking more to people that are making. Probably what your average graduates making. Like if they're that they're making around 40k after tax, just get a, you know, just get a low, mentally low energy job and then put all your mental energy into learning something else. So you can increase your salary if you're making a hundred thousand dollars a year that does not apply to you.

That's different.

Ryan: Where I agree with you though, is that the mental energy thing is huge also in that if you're 100% sure. That you are doing a career pivot. You are no longer going to be a teacher, regardless. You might want to be a programmer. You might want to be a coder, but you're not, but you're 100% sure that you're not going to be a teacher.

Then it's not going to hurt you to do what you did. Or do what you said and switch careers or switch to another job

Hannah: In his vein too. Some of you are salaried, but you're you're making on the lower end of the spectrum. Like the one I was talking about, you're making like what the average graduate is making or less, you need to calculate your hourly wage so that you can find out, what would take the place of your current work? That's another thing, especially for like teachers, people that work at daycares, stuff like that, where you're doing, you're doing work, that your hourly is actually pretty low. You might find that finding a job that that is less mentally draining and actually pays you a couple dollars more an hour is going to be a really good trade off for you in the interim.

For sure. Like we, you know, work at PetSmart, I dunno. Just do something, do something that you don't mind and that that's that's, simple. simple work.

And then

Ryan: the next thing with the career pivot is if you are going to do that, you really have to come up with a plan of. How are you going to execute that career pivot?

So already in the example of our teacher and coder, are you going to self, teach yourself how to code? What kind of coding are you going to? Are you going to learn?

Hannah: What kind of jobs are you going to be applying for and then work backwards from there?

Ryan: Right. Are you trying to, are you trying to learn how to build websites?

Hannah: How fast?

Ryan: Are you trying to learn how to build applications. These are all types of questions that you need to figure out. And then when you figure it out, exactly what you said, you can deconstruct it and you can work backwards from there. Right. Are you going to take a bootcamp or are you just gonna watch a bunch of YouTube videos and try to figure it out.

Hannah: And then for some people too, if your pivot is pivoting from a white collar job to a blue collar job, again, do your hourly wage calculation, find out how much you actually make an hour. And then see if you can find blue collar paid training that pays you more than your hourly wage now that's another good way to do it as well.

That really minimizes the risk because I would say it's almost easier to get paid on the job training because at the point they're paying for on the job training, they, they need people. So that's another good option too.

Ryan: It might not always be the case that the paid on the job training is going to pay you more than what you would have made, but if you're able to, so just for an example, like, okay, if you're going to go and let's just say coding bootcamp or something, say you attend a four week coding boot camp and it costs $10,000.

Right. And. Okay. What about, there's a lower position that is paid training and the course is, you know, six months long, but you get paid, you know, $15 an hour to do it. Now you got to do the math and to see, okay. Does it make sense? Does it make sense to get paid a little bit while I train? Or does it make sense for me to

Hannah: Fork out this money now in exchange for speed?

Ryan: Yeah. And also. Usually pay training depending on your field, it comes with a contract at the end of it. Not always,

Hannah: Yeah, but sometimes.

Ryan: But sometimes it does.

Hannah: Yeah.

Ryan: Especially if it's a lot of money, especially if you're a highly licensed

Hannah: I usually do into a funnel for work, that's why they're paying you. It's because they think that they're going to be able to hire you to do work and they're training you to do it

Ryan: So, if you're going to lock you in for $50,000 for two years, When you could have taken a bootcamp or done a vocational training or something else taught yourself and you could make a hundred thousand dollars. You got to wait, you have to do the math on that. And you gotta wait opportunities.

Hannah: Only you can prevent forest fires.

That's, that's really a you decision. You have to see, you know, that's going to come down to a really personal calculation too, of like how much you have, how much you can afford, what your living situation is, responsibilities, all that kind of stuff.

Ryan: And then, so I think one of the concerns here is that.

Okay. You've lost your job suddenly and you weren't prepared. And now you're out there. You are applying and you, you are getting interviews, but you're just getting a lot of rejections

as your unemployment goes longer. What do you do? Do you just keep hanging out at the house? Do you keep, you know, just doing whatever, keep applying. I think if your unemployment starts to run long, if you are trying to find things to do or ways to keep your skills up, especially if you, if you work in a field where you need to continually keep your skills up.

It's a good idea to look into volunteering. Volunteer at your local church or your local nonprofit or whatever,

Hannah: Anywhere that will take you really.

Ryan: And what specifically for something that you need to work on your skills for?

Hannah: Yeah.

Ryan: Ideally so that you could keep your skills up and that you could have somebody to vouch for the fact that you have been working on it and then for you to get, you know, proof or like a portfolio, depending on what you're doing. So for example, if you're like I'm out of work, videographer, some sort of media production, content production, you can say, okay, I'm going to go and volunteer at my local nonprofit. And if you do videos, I'm going to do, I'm going to make your promo videos.

Right. And now you're, meeting new people in the industry, or rather in a certain space getting your name out there. And you're also building up a portfolio of work.

Hannah: And uh, you know, you can ask those people for references to later if you need to.

Ryan: Exactly. And so the other thing that you could do when unemployment starts to run long is you could start working on side projects, right.

And if you are. In anything really, you can always run a side project, right. Just to keep your skills up and to keep, possibly create some passive income as well, or some active income, but income in general.

Hannah: Yeah. Like, make print on demand shirts or sell information like PDF information or Canva templates, or it doesn't matter, something.

Ryan: It doesn't matter if say if you're, you know, the, if you're in,

Hannah: Do that entry work on Fiverr doesn't it, doesn't matter.

Ryan: Right? Exactly. Or if you're in blue collar work, if you're like in construction and you have the skills, you don't pick it up side jobs. Right. And having those before and afters to show you know,

Hannah: Potential employer.

Ryan: I shouldn't be like, yeah, this is, this is the deck that I built.

Right. Or, you know, I did, I did the electrical on this whole house.

Hannah: Yeah. That's a good idea.

Ryan: Whatever, and just having

the ability to keep your skills fresh and also hopefully to make some income. And so the biggest thing that. We want it to get across is just keep plugging away.

Hannah: Yeah. Keep your head up kid. It's hard. It's hard.

Ryan: It's tough. And you know, if you lost your job because of things outside of your control, if you lost your job because of things within your control.

It's going to be okay.

Hannah: Yeah.

Ryan: Right.

Hannah: You're going to be all right.

Ryan: If your priority is finding work as quickly as possible, you don't have time. You can't wait around. Get out there, get your name out there, fix your resume and start applying. You know what I mean? If it runs along, then you start volunteering at, you know, non-profits or whatever church, something help your friends out, do something.

Hannah: And activate your circle of people and just ask around for work.

Ryan: Yeah. That's these are the types of things that, are going to see results. It might not see results immediately.

Hannah: Sometimes too. I will say sometimes really good things come out of that . Sometimes that the it's just a change, you know? And sometimes out of that change, you're going to be really surprised too, with the good opportunities that come out of it, you might be really surprised actually, you end up changing industries and you're really happy and where you end up.

And so it's not all a consolation prize too. I think that's important to say sometimes the change you're going to be. You're gonna look back on it and be really glad that it happened.

Ryan: Absolutely.

Hannah: Yeah, that happens a lot, actually.

Ryan: I think so. I think so.

Hannah: Yeah.

Ryan: They're easy to get stuck in a rut. It's very easy to be very comfortable.

And when something like this happens where you suddenly lose your job and if it really is genuinely sudden

Yeah. Just forced it grow.

Hannah: Yeah.

Ryan: And it just forces you and not saying it's going to be easy times are going to get hard. I mean, the spigot of money is turned off. Right. And now

Hannah: You gotta go look for more.

Ryan: Right. You have to go find out how to turn that back on.

Right.

Hannah: And this real stressful, we're not trying to minimize that. It's just, just keep in mind that there is a light at the end of the tunnel, and sometimes it's brighter than where you were at now. So just, just keep that in mind.

Ryan: Yeah, absolutely.

Hannah: I know you're not by yourself.

Everybody's going through this right now.

Ryan: Yeah.

Hannah: Okay. Well, I think, I think that's it for today. And like we said at the beginning, just want to make sure you folks know we do have a newsletter that you can sign up for on degreefreenetwork.com and Ryan and I fill that thing with different types of job opportunities, resources that you can use to get new skills. We also include degree free news. So companies that are hiring standards that are changing, just watching the shifting winds of the job market right now, and then also just resources that Ryan and I use that we find really useful, like books and books and different stuff like that, that you're, you're gonna to want to, you're going to want to read, so yeah, make sure you sign up for that at this on the website, which is degreefreenetwork.com.

Ryan: Yeah, and if you guys enjoyed today, if you guys made it all the way through, thank you very much. If you guys could consider us leaving us a five star review, wherever it is that you get your podcasts, YouTube, wherever it is that you're watching or listening to us. If you have any questions, comments, or concerns, you can always reach out to us contact that degreefreenetwork.com.

That's her email drop us a line. We always love to hear from your eyes. And even if it's just a little comment, A lot of times we have questions and it kind of make helps us to make content for the show. So that helps.

Hannah: Yeah.

Ryan: Also last ask guys, if you could give us a follow I'm @ryankmaruyama on the socials she's @hannahmaruyama.

I think that's it guys until next time. Aloha..