May 22, 2024

How ChatGPT Experience > College Degrees and How to Gain That Experience (DF#149)

How ChatGPT Experience > College Degrees and How to Gain That Experience

How Business Leaders Value Chat GPT Experience

Join us as we talk about the growing importance of vocational creativity and the impact of ChatGPT experience in the job market.

What You’ll Learn:

- How half of business leaders now value Chat GPT experience more than a college degree, signaling a shift in hiring preferences.
- The potential benefits of AI in enabling individuals to focus on more valuable work rather than replacing them in the workforce.
- Practical tips on effectively using Chat GPT in job searches and the evolving landscape of work due to technological advancements.

Explore the conversation on the evolving role of AI in the workforce and the significance of vocational creativity in securing and excelling in job roles.

Discover how free tools like Chat GPT can enhance your job search and career prospects in the digital age.

Enjoy the episode!

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Links and Notes from the Episode

Episode Summary:

In this episode, Ryan and Hannah Maruyama stress the importance of vocational creativity and the value of Chat GPT in the workplace. Half of business leaders view Chat GPT experience as more beneficial than a college degree in some cases, highlighting the changing dynamics of job qualifications.

AI is seen as a tool to enhance productivity and shift job functions rather than entirely replacing jobs, with Chat GPT being utilized for job searches and providing tips for effective use. The conversation dives into the diverse uses of Chat GPT, from creating recipes to problem-solving in the workplace. Specific instructions are key to achieving desired results, and understanding business concepts is crucial for roles like systems administration. Vocational creativity is emphasized as a path to career growth and valuable insights, showcasing the importance of exploring new job opportunities.

The episode also touches on utilizing Chat GPT for job searches and career navigation. Practical experience is valued over traditional education according to a study with business leaders, advocating for informed decision-making using available tools. A forthcoming book/workbook on vocational creativity and career options is highlighted, with an emphasis on continual learning and improvement.

Connect with Ryan:

Connect With Hannah:

Action Steps & Recommendations:

  • Embrace vocational creativity and explore new job opportunities
  • Utilize Chat GPT experience for job searches and career navigation
  • Prioritize practical experience over traditional education
  • Be specific with instructions when using Chat GPT for tasks like generating cover letters
  • Understand business concepts for roles like systems administration
  • Preorder the upcoming book/workbook for vocational creativity and career guidance
  • Focus on improvement over time and utilize AI tools for career development


  • 00:00:42 - Business leaders value Chat GPT experience over college degrees for entry-level positions
  • 00:03:14 - AI and Chat GPT automation enable humans to do more high-value work
  • 00:07:22 - College students and recent grads misusing Chat GPT for job search
  • 00:11:28 - Understanding how recipe ads work to increase dwell time on web pages.
  • 00:12:20 - Utilizing Chat GPT for quick and efficient recipe suggestions and menu planning.
  • 00:14:55 - Importance of providing specific instructions to Chat GPT to maximize its usefulness.
  • 00:22:43 - Using Chat GPT and other tools for job search
  • 00:25:12 - Value of ChatGPT experience compared to a college degree
  • 00:27:57 - Parental guilt about navigating career choices for children
  • 00:32:33 - The workbook is a valuable resource that will take time to go through
  • 00:33:19 - Parents should not feel guilty about not knowing everything
  • 00:34:56 - Encouraging the use of AI systems and programs for job opportunities

References, Resources Mentioned & Suggested Reading:

Episode Transcript
Please enjoy this transcript or our episode!

Please note the transcript may have a few errors. We're human. It can be hard to catch all the errors from a full length conversation. Enjoy!

Ryan Maruyama [00:00:00]:
Vocational creativity is so important. You know, when I first invented that system, that thing that these words put together, I mean, I knew it was important or at least I thought it was important, but I didn't realize how critical it was going to be to pretty much everything that we do and the problem that people have when trying to help their children and their young adults get into their first role. Aloha folks, and welcome back to degree free. We are super excited to have you here. We have a bunch of things to get into today. I actually only have one thing to get into today, but I think it's gonna take a little bit. I am going to be going over an article about a survey that I found. This is from

Ryan Maruyama [00:00:42]:
And the headline of this article from this survey is half of business leaders say Chat GPT experience is more valuable than a college degree.

Hannah Maruyama [00:00:51]:
Oh, fire in the hole.

Ryan Maruyama [00:00:53]:
Yeah. It's a really good headline. I mean, it's good enough to have us talk about it here, but let me read you the actual first paragraph of this. According to our survey findings, nearly half, 49% of business leaders say that in certain cases, possessing experience with Chachi Boutique can offer more value than holding a college degree. Conversely, 36% of respondents disagree with this notion, while 12% remain unsure. So I'll give you the bullet points that they have here as well. 80% believe Chat GPT experience is valuable for entry level positions. 6 in 10 companies require chat gpt experience for at least some entry level positions.

Ryan Maruyama [00:01:36]:
Half of companies are providing Chat GPT training. 8 in 10 say Chat GPT experience will be even more important in 2025.

Hannah Maruyama [00:01:46]:
I'm very curious what chat gbt training looks like.

Ryan Maruyama [00:01:49]:
I think it's just Using it? Yes, exactly. Literally. I would imagine that it is prompt engineering training. Here's how to structure a question in order to get the correct answer. Exactly. Because these businesses have been using it. It's been an invaluable tool for a lot of these businesses. I'm sure they've been using it.

Ryan Maruyama [00:02:09]:
So they have their own prompts. They might have even made their own small little apps to help them with their daily workflow. And the Chat gpt training is literally just training you on using that tool and trying to get the output that you normally get out of it.

Hannah Maruyama [00:02:27]:
This kind of brings up something interesting. So at work recently, one of our really smart developers was talking about how he had tried to engineer himself out of a job with ChatGPT. And he was saying that despite his best efforts, this is someone who builds AI. That's what he does. And he was saying that to the best of his effort, he could only automate 73% of his work. And even then he had to go back through and correct. Because what he was trying to do was completely make it so that he wasn't actually having to do any work and he still had to go back through. I'm saying this because I know that when we talk about AI and chat gpt, a lot of people and especially parents are worried about their kids' jobs being taken away by AI.

Hannah Maruyama [00:03:12]:
But this developer was saying that he actually theorizes that all it's going to do is enable people to do more work and take more of the rote boring part of labor off of the plate of humans. Things that we really shouldn't be doing anyway, because they require so much meticulous and repeatable things. And no wonder these companies are jumping all over this because there are so many tasks that take people a lot of time for no reason. And so you can have employees do things that are much more high value than completely repeating tasks over and over again.

Ryan Maruyama [00:03:45]:
Yeah. There's a lot of value in the entry level roles knowing chat g p t from everything, from customer support to content creation, to creativity, and then moreover thinking about training as well. It's really expensive to train people. We've talked about it before for job seekers going out there, or if you're trying to help your child get their first job, that's not necessarily a retail job or dishwashing job, which nothing wrong with that. If you're trying to do something like that, you might want to know how long does it normally take to train individuals. And it's usually 6 months depending on which survey you look at, but it's 6 months before they start to bring any positive return on investment into the business. I think training is one of the largest places as well for entry level people because you can train, like I was talking about these little custom apps. You can have a little knowledge base set up for all of your internal tasks and all of your internal things that you do, operations.

Ryan Maruyama [00:04:50]:
And you can just have that trainee once they're done with their, you know, 2 weeks of training or whatever, then they query that database whenever they need help. And then if you can't find it in that database,

Hannah Maruyama [00:05:02]:
Then you go to a human,

Ryan Maruyama [00:05:03]:
then you go to a human. Right. Exactly. And I know that's exactly what they would do in corporate America because 12 years ago it was, here's a binder that is your knowledge base.

Hannah Maruyama [00:05:14]:
And good luck.

Ryan Maruyama [00:05:15]:
And you

Hannah Maruyama [00:05:15]:
get to find it. So there's so much fear mongering around ChattyPT 2. This is a little bit of an offshoot of our topic, but recently we had a CNBC article come out, I think last week it was, and someone on LinkedIn commented and basically just said working in AI is not a real job. And it's silly to pretend that there's a future in this, blah, blah, blah. This is actually an offshoot because I read some data recently about gen z and their use of ChatGp. So gen z defined as I started doing this for you, because I know you're rough with the generations, but Gen Z is 1996 to 2004. That's the age range. So 61% of Gen Z surveyed in this particular study, I'll find it and link it.

Hannah Maruyama [00:05:53]:
But basically they said they couldn't imagine going through their Workday without using ChatGPT. And people were like, oh no, that's terrible, blah, blah, blah. But I'm like, hold on a second. And this is what I said to the naysayer on LinkedIn too, is he said, is this is going to ruin thought based jobs, whatever that means. Cause I was like, I think all jobs are thought based jobs. He said that it's going to destroy them. And I said, well, no, I mean, the sentence that you're using here could have been applied to the internet. And I'm sure it was, I'm sure that people were like, oh no, once the internet exists, no one's going to be able to work anymore, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

Hannah Maruyama [00:06:23]:
The end of the world's coming. We're not going to have any work. Everyone's going to be unemployed. And in that same way, it's basically a generational tool that changes the landscape of work, just like the internet did. And that's what I try to relate to parents. You know, when I'm talking to them about AI, I just say it's very similar to how the internet changed your work and changed the opportunities available to you. It may have eventually gotten rid of some jobs, but it also created a ton of new jobs. I don't think people are realizing that the jobs are just going to shift around.

Hannah Maruyama [00:06:52]:
They're not going to go away. They're just going to move and we're going to have to do less boring stuff as humans. And I think more work is actually going to get done as a result of it. And I'm excited to see it, but I just thought it was an interesting point that gen Z can't imagine working without chat GPT in the same way that millennials and gen X, which is our agent a little bit older, can't imagine working without the internet because the internet touches everything and AI is going to become like that.

Ryan Maruyama [00:07:18]:
It was funny in preparation for this episode actually wasn't even in preparation. It was me not doing my work.

Hannah Maruyama [00:07:25]:

Ryan Maruyama [00:07:26]:
Yeah. It's procrastination. When I need to procrastinate from doing my work, like, oh, I'll just find some news articles for the podcast.

Hannah Maruyama [00:07:33]:
What do you mean? Research?

Ryan Maruyama [00:07:34]:
Yeah. Yeah. Just blow off my work. It's like, what? Do do your work. One of the articles that I found and it wasn't interesting enough. I didn't think to have on this podcast, but now I guess it is, or at least a little bit of it. I didn't read the full thing. I skimmed it and I don't have it in front of me here, but basically is an opinion piece of how college students and recent grads are misusing chat gpt for their job search.

Ryan Maruyama [00:07:58]:
Basically all of your cover letters and everything that look the same.

Hannah Maruyama [00:08:02]:
They're supposed to, the ATS is looking for the same template,

Ryan Maruyama [00:08:04]:
but not only that it's also you get the behavior you incentivize.

Hannah Maruyama [00:08:08]:
Your hiring system is broken. So people are fixing it themselves.

Ryan Maruyama [00:08:11]:
Well, yeah. So, I mean, if you want a cover letter and everything like that, like, okay, well, here's a cover letter. But then also as a job seeker, if you're looking at that and you see that, okay, that's how employers are feeling or at least this is how this employer is feeling or this is how this HR professional is feeling. It's pretty easy to differentiate yourself now with a cover letter. If you if you're like, okay. Write me a cover letter. Even though

Hannah Maruyama [00:08:33]:
you don't need one, you don't read it most of the time.

Ryan Maruyama [00:08:34]:
That's not what I'm saying. I'm saying write a cover letter for this marketing associate job and whatever it comes out with. Don't use that, change it a lot. And I've talked about this before on the podcast and this kind of leads me down the road of tips to use Chat2bt, and we can link that episode of the show notes degreefree.co4/podcast. It was for like 14 tips to use Chat2bt in your job search or something like that. And it's still valid today. You can go back and listen to that episode, but I'll just give you broad strokes here. The more you put in to chat GBT, the better your prompts, the better your output's going to be.

Ryan Maruyama [00:09:10]:
The more you feed it in your chat thread, the better it is going to be. And the longer your prompts, the better usually your results. It's funny because the understanding of these tools and chat GBT and things like it, like there's claudotai as well by anthropic. There's Gemini by Google. There's a bunch of smaller little competitors as well. Well. And there's a bunch of people, almost seemingly infinite amount of quote AI companies that just have a front end. They've built a little small app that just has an API into open AI's.

Hannah Maruyama [00:09:49]:
Can you define API for those of us who struggle?

Ryan Maruyama [00:09:52]:
Application programming interface, literally just connecting the backend of your app to the backend of somebody else's.

Hannah Maruyama [00:10:01]:
So they can talk to each other.

Ryan Maruyama [00:10:02]:
They can talk to each other. Right. Exactly. And so you're bringing information from one place to another place, whatever that information might be. We've come a long way from the beginning of chat gbt hitting the market. And when I first interface with chat GBT. I had no idea what to tell it what to do. So I'm thinking like, oh, well, write me a song about whatever.

Ryan Maruyama [00:10:29]:

Hannah Maruyama [00:10:29]:
me a haiku about.

Ryan Maruyama [00:10:30]:
Yeah, exactly. My name is Ryan and make me something funny, literally so silly, but then to think now the use cases are starting to really get solidified and it's seemingly infinite. The amount of use cases that are out there.

Hannah Maruyama [00:10:43]:
We were just talking about AI generated food the other day. Actually, that's a good example of it.

Ryan Maruyama [00:10:47]:
That's actually really funny. The AI generated.

Hannah Maruyama [00:10:51]:
We only eat AI generated food in this house.

Ryan Maruyama [00:10:53]:
Pretty much. If I don't know the recipe for something I have given up Google because I cannot stand recipe websites.

Hannah Maruyama [00:11:02]:
When you read a recipe website is always like, and my cat's mom's aunt died. And then I went on a journey to find myself to I something Illinois or something like that. And then I lived there for 3 months and then I moved again and it's like, oh my God, please stop. Just tell me how many cups of sugar are in these mom's place.

Ryan Maruyama [00:11:22]:
Well, you can see what you cook and what I cook. I don't make muffins and we've talked about it before, but the reason why they do that is to make you stay longer on the page, increase their dwell time, get higher Google ad revenue.

Hannah Maruyama [00:11:36]:
That's why the recipe ads are so crazy people, just so you know.

Ryan Maruyama [00:11:39]:
Yeah, exactly. Like that's why they do that.

Hannah Maruyama [00:11:41]:
Right. The more places I can put an ad on here.

Ryan Maruyama [00:11:43]:
And the more you have to scroll, the longer you stay on the page. I'm sick of that. And I just go to chat GBT. It's also easier as well. I'm glad you brought that up. I was actually going to bring that up. Recipes and that use case is a really easy way to show how useful these things are in a more general way If you're trying to help your young adult gain some experience. Right? Because we just talked about this.

Ryan Maruyama [00:12:07]:
80% of business leaders say that having experience with chat gbt is either very valuable or valuable. If you go to Chi Chi Poutine, you can literally tell it. The other day, I was like, oh, I need a, like, soft pork ribs recipe. That's all I put in. And then they gave me a pork ribs recipe and that I made it. That's simple, but let's say I only have 3 items in my fridge and we're having a party and I need an appetizer. Okay. I need an appetizer that only uses this type of meat, this type of vegetable and this type of whatever, whatever the 3 ingredients are, 2 vegetables and 1 meat or something like that.

Ryan Maruyama [00:12:44]:
And then boom, perfect. It'll give you a list of everything with those constraints. You tell it your constraints. You tell it what you want out of it, and then it'll give you recipes that fit that. Or another use case is like I am having a party with a bunch of people and it's 7 people are coming over. I need to make a menu. It's going to be a 3 course meal or it's gonna be family style rather, either one, either a course out meal or it's gonna be family style. I need you to make menu.

Ryan Maruyama [00:13:16]:
And with that menu, I need you to make a recipe for each dish. But 2 of them are gluten free. 1 of them is a pescatarian. Whatever, whatever, whatever. Give me a menu that can accommodate everyone. And it will do all of that really, really easily, much quicker than it would have taken you

Hannah Maruyama [00:13:38]:
to do all the research,

Ryan Maruyama [00:13:39]:
to do the research, to think about it. Absolutely. You give it your constraints and then it operates within your constraints. And that's where getting back to that misusing chat GPT and all of them looking in the same. I bet you what these college kids are doing is just write me a cover letter for a marketing associate job.

Hannah Maruyama [00:13:54]:
And then they're just using that same one.

Ryan Maruyama [00:13:55]:
And the reason why that's bad is because you're not giving it enough constraints. You're not giving it enough cues of what you want of the output that you want out of it. Instead, to get a much better cover letter, your prompt should be like 3 paragraphs long and saying, I want a cover letter for a company that does this, this, and this.

Hannah Maruyama [00:14:15]:
Chicago, tell them I'm excited, blah, blah, blah. Tell them that I have these skills or experience, blah, blah, blah, blah.

Ryan Maruyama [00:14:21]:
Yeah, exactly. For our business and for what we do here, we use chat gpt every single day or I used to have a gpt every single day and it is invaluable. What you really need to do, what just helped me in the understanding of chattyPT and getting what you need out of it is you have to think like a leader, thinking like a leader helps a lot

Hannah Maruyama [00:14:46]:
instead of letting it lead.

Ryan Maruyama [00:14:47]:
Yeah. What I mean by thinking by a leader is that

Hannah Maruyama [00:14:50]:
Over communicate instructions and make sure that they know not this and not this, but this very specific middle part is what I need. And I need you to hit these three points in this way.

Ryan Maruyama [00:15:01]:

Hannah Maruyama [00:15:01]:
That there's not a wild variation. It should spit out what you're looking for because you give it the correct instructions.

Ryan Maruyama [00:15:07]:
And that might be difficult for a bunch of people listening to this for both job seekers and for young adults, because you might not have ever been a leader, but you've definitely been led before. Let's imagine that for the young adults out there, if you're never had a job before your teachers will come back to class and bring a blue rag and you come back to class. It was a big blue towel. Exactly.

Hannah Maruyama [00:15:33]:
Instead of a small blue rag.

Ryan Maruyama [00:15:35]:
Instead, if your teacher had said, bring me back a kitchen towel that is blue. Oh, okay. Well, that's a specific size. But when you bring it back, all of the kitchen towels might be different sizes because it's a bit well

Hannah Maruyama [00:15:50]:
Everybody has different sized kitchen towels.

Ryan Maruyama [00:15:52]:
Well, this is standard size for most, but it's still not super standard. Some of them have little hand rags because that's what they use in their kitchen, stuff like that, or washcloths because that's what they use in their kitchen to, like, wipe up the towel, the counters and stuff like that. Instead, if your teacher had said, bring me an 11 inch by 15 inch kitchen towel that is blue

Hannah Maruyama [00:16:13]:
or light blue.

Ryan Maruyama [00:16:14]:
And now everybody brings in an 11 by 15, but now it's navy blue Robin's egg, blue teal, whatever. Right? Now it's all off. And then she's like, okay, well now I have to do 11 by 15 inches towel. That is all Navy blue. That gets you closer to all uniform, but then you're gonna have a problem with material. They're like, okay. Well, some of them are polyester. Some of them are all cotton.

Ryan Maruyama [00:16:39]:
Whatever. Whatever. Some of them have designs on them. Some of them don't. So anyway, what I'm saying is that the more specific that you can get with your instructions, the more uniform, the better the expectations of the result, the better the result will be.

Hannah Maruyama [00:16:53]:

Ryan Maruyama [00:16:53]:
If that makes sense.

Hannah Maruyama [00:16:54]:
Yeah, it does.

Ryan Maruyama [00:16:54]:
And so, you know, if you just say, bring me a blue rag, that's going to get wildly different results. Then give me an 11 by 15 navy blue, all cotton, no design

Hannah Maruyama [00:17:04]:
kitchen towel, kitchen towel. That was a good explanation.

Ryan Maruyama [00:17:07]:
If you think like that for every prompt that you make that you give to chat gbt, your output is going to skyrocket and it's gonna go through the roof. But I just thought that this was really, really interesting, this whole article about Chatt GPT being more useful than a college degree or at least more desirable than a college degree, Enhancing worker productivity, increasing worker knowledge, fostering creativity.

Hannah Maruyama [00:17:33]:
It's more about problem solving too, because fundamentally you have to be able to go, all right, I have this issue. And then, like, we've talked about with prompt engineering just now, you have to be able to articulate the problem. So what a lot of people say is, and this is just a misconception about ChatGPT. When people say this, I wonder sometimes I go, have you ever even used it? Because it sounds like you might not have, but if people say, Oh, you know, it's going to give you fake information. And I'm like, we're not talking about using it for researching news or current events. What we're talking about is using it to go, okay, I have all this information in an Excel sheet. I need you to make it into a list and then I need you to move it over and format it with bold headers so that I can turn it into our report. Please give me 3 suggestions for how I could turn this data that I just gave you from this Excel sheet into different charts so I can use it for a report.

Hannah Maruyama [00:18:16]:
That's an example of using ChatGPT to help your work, but you have to have the critical thinking to go, all right. I have to have it pull from here. And then I needed to put it into also this list. And then I need from that list it to give me a list of suggestions for how I could make it visual for people to look at it and see it easily. That's using ChatGPT in your work. That's an example of problem solving using it, not a, Oh, it's going to be fake news. It can't give you fake news about how to pull something from an Excel sheet, put it in a list, and then give you some suggestions about how to make it into a visual chart. It's just the way it

Ryan Maruyama [00:18:44]:
is. Yeah. You and I were talking about this last night. We were talking about one of the people in the degree free launch program that is going through it. And one of the things that they honed in on was like a systems administrator, which is a wild thing for 17 year old to go through and to think about. So for systems administrator, for those that don't know, basically, in a nutshell, it's somebody that keeps up in instance or your company's version of a software. So think of a big company. Think of Salesforce, HubSpot, ServiceNow, those types of things, sysadmin, systems administrators, they keep up your company's version of that software.

Ryan Maruyama [00:19:29]:
It was funny because we were talking about systems administrators, and I was saying, like, yes. Is the training for system administrators useful? Absolutely. What I mean by the training is just like Salesforce administrator certification, HubSpot administration certification, those types of things. Are those things useful? Absolutely. Knowing how to use a software and how to manipulate things within it is a crucial part of the job. The thing that really matters from that level, the thing that's gonna be really, really helpful for that role, more helpful than the actual, this is what you do. This is how you move this thing from here to there. That's table stakes for the job, but what's going to be better higher level is just understanding business at a high level, literally just understanding how business operates.

Ryan Maruyama [00:20:15]:
Because if you can understand how business operates, then you can make the insights of like, oh, well, I need to move this from here to there.

Hannah Maruyama [00:20:24]:
And if I do that now, people can see this piece of information, which is going to change the way they act, which is going to help them make more sales or save more money or save more time.

Ryan Maruyama [00:20:32]:
Yeah. So you have the what down and you have the why down, which is more important than the how, then you just figure out how to do it, but you have the what down and you have the why down. If you can infer that from your own mind, especially as a quote, entry level person, you're going to move up the ladder really, really quickly.

Hannah Maruyama [00:20:52]:
Like lightning.

Ryan Maruyama [00:20:52]:
Yeah. I thought that was really interesting that one 17 year old is like, you know, I think that sounds like a good good job.

Hannah Maruyama [00:20:58]:
Well, of all the ones, it was a huge list, and she narrowed it down to that one just stood out to her. It's a software specific systems admin. Of all the ones I gave her, I gave her a very wide range and she just went, that is super interesting. And she had never heard of it before. That's the biggest thing, which kind of just leans into our vocational creativity and the launch program. What's more interesting is that the job she works now, she uses something that puts information into it and just didn't know that existed. And now she goes, oh, and there's somebody that controls that on the backside after I put that data in. And I said, yeah, and it could be you.

Hannah Maruyama [00:21:31]:
And she was stoked on it.

Ryan Maruyama [00:21:32]:
That's the vocational creativity part, touching on what you were saying, expanding on what you were saying. Like vocational creativity is so important. You know, when I first invented that system, that thing that these words put together, I mean, I knew it was important or at least I thought it was important, but I didn't realize how critical it was going to be to pretty much everything that we do and the problem that people have when trying to help their children and their young adults get into their first roles. Hey there. I hope you're enjoying this episode of the degree free podcast. At degree free, we wanna help everyone thrive and succeed without needing a college degree. And the only way to truly reach everyone is with your help. If you're getting value out of this episode or if this is your second, 3rd, or 4th episode that you're tuning into, if you could just ship this to a friend, just click that one button and share it with someone in your contacts or on your stories.

Ryan Maruyama [00:22:22]:
It would mean the world to us. And more importantly, get our message out to more people who need help getting out of their current situation. If you could do that right now, that would mean a whole lot. But even job seekers and career changers, like, how can you get a job that you don't know exists? The last thing that I wanted to say before we wrap my part up here is for those people that are listening to this and you're like, I've never used chat gpt. I don't know what these tools are. How do I get started now? It's so difficult. It seems so huge. And then how do I help my child do this stuff as well? The tip is the same tip that I had in that episode, 14 tips to use chat to your TPT in your job search.

Ryan Maruyama [00:23:07]:
It is basically just to use these tools, to boot up these tools. All of them are free in some way or another. They usually just lock up their most powerful features and their most powerful models, but the other stuff is free. And so you just go and boot it up and you use it every day. So once again, you can Google it. There's Chat GPT. There's Gemini. There's Claude, and then, like I said, there's a bunch of other ones, smaller ones.

Ryan Maruyama [00:23:33]:
And then there are a bunch of different tools that use their APIs on the back end. Really just start using these every single day. What I did to get started, and it still to this day, is I just replaced Google with it. Whenever I had a query or whenever I had a search term that I needed, I would go to chat GPT first. And while I don't always go to chat GPT first anymore, because of the 2 weeks that I did that, where every single search I went to Chat TpT First. Now I know, like, okay, when I'm searching something, this is the type of thing that I use Chat GPT for. This is the type of thing I use Google for. And then the way to do that is you can just download their apps and you just put chat gbt onto your home row.

Ryan Maruyama [00:24:21]:
It's right there. You don't forget. And usually, oh, yeah. That's right. Okay. I'm gonna use chat GPT for this instead. You learn, oh, okay. This is how this works.

Ryan Maruyama [00:24:28]:
This is the output it's giving me. This is how I change it. Oh, that wasn't very good. Well, you talk to it, you be a leader and you lead it down the path that you want it to help you go down. That I thought was interesting. You have to bring it up on a podcast. I mean, 8 and 10 people at least say that it's important.

Hannah Maruyama [00:24:48]:
The last point is when I was reading through this, I did want people to note that the folks that were surveyed for this study, all of the people who they asked about this, all the business leaders in question had at least a bachelor's degree or more. So for those listening, it's papered people who are saying that ChatGPT experience is worth more than a college degree. And I want to say that because a lot of people just, oh, well, so degree free people are saying that a college degree doesn't matter because they don't have a college degree. No, it's business leaders regardless, but all of the people specifically in this study had to have bought a degree in order to be qualified to comment in this study.

Ryan Maruyama [00:25:26]:
I don't know if it's bought a degree actually. Let me just read exactly what it says. I don't think it's bachelor's degree at all. This is the demographic criteria, but I'm skipping to the second sentence. This criteria included age 25 plus, household income greater than $50,000 a year, organizational roles, c level executive, HR manager, director, president, owner slash partner, and senior management, company size greater than 10 people, and education, technical college, college, or postgraduate. That doesn't necessarily mean that you have a bachelor's degree, technical college, college, postgraduate.

Hannah Maruyama [00:26:03]:
But they have a degree of some kind?

Ryan Maruyama [00:26:05]:
Personally, I don't know what technical college, college, or postgraduate means, but I'm assuming it's the associate's degree. But I could imagine that if you go to a technical college and it doesn't say graduate as well.

Hannah Maruyama [00:26:16]:
That's true.

Ryan Maruyama [00:26:16]:
That's true. And so I just want to be accurate with our representation of this.

Hannah Maruyama [00:26:21]:
I want to jump back to the vocational creativity piece really quick because it reminded me of a call I was on the other day with a parent and his daughter. We were on this call and he's a CPA and he was just saying, wow. As I was going through her options and we were talking about the jobs that ended up on her list and the launch program, he was just saying, wow, I feel so guilty that I couldn't find these or that I didn't know about any of these, because I think a lot of parents are feeling guilty because they don't know how to do hours and hours and hours of research and use all of these different things in order to find different job types and categorize them and lay them out clearly. And the thing that I just wanted to drive home to parents who feel guilty or feel bad that they don't know how to help their children navigate the choice and make it simple for their kids to choose what they're going to do after they graduate high school. Is that it's not something that you do every day. This guy's a CPA. He does his own version of that by reading really complicated tax code, taking people's problems and then synthesizing them down. So it looks really simple and that you save $23,000 blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, as opposed to here's the tax code.

Hannah Maruyama [00:27:33]:
Good luck. Figure it out yourself. It's going to take them hours and hours and hours and hours to even figure out how to do, you know, their 10.40 easy taxes because taxes are ridiculous, but that's a good example of how it's his job to read the tax code and synthesize really complicated stuff and make it really simple. You don't expect him to do anything else and know how to go into a Michelin star restaurant and cook a meal. Why? Because he's a CPA, that's his job. And in the same way. So for parents, especially if you you're working, you have a full time job and you don't know how to navigate this and you don't have the time in order to sit down and do all of the stuff to get up to speed where you can do all of this research and then compile it and then sit your child down and guide them through the process really methodically. Don't feel bad about that because the reason we can do it is because we do it all the time.

Hannah Maruyama [00:28:19]:
And we invented all of these systems and all of this logic and all of these methods in order to do it efficiently. So don't feel bad if you feel kind of lost because that's okay. You have a job that you're already doing. No wonder you don't have all of the time to go and figure out how to do it yourself. I want

Ryan Maruyama [00:28:36]:
to clarify 10.40 easy is a specific form that you use when your taxes are very easy.

Hannah Maruyama [00:28:44]:
Yeah. But it's still not easy though.

Ryan Maruyama [00:28:45]:
It's very easy actually.

Hannah Maruyama [00:28:46]:
Okay. Well, TurboTax marketing got me. That's the only tax form that could come to

Ryan Maruyama [00:28:51]:
mind. Well, 10:40 is the form for everybody.

Hannah Maruyama [00:28:55]:

Ryan Maruyama [00:28:55]:
But 10:40 easy is you the form that you use when it's very, very simple.

Hannah Maruyama [00:28:59]:
It's been years since I did my taxes.

Ryan Maruyama [00:29:01]:
I used to do my taxes when I was like 16. You know what I mean? Pretty much 16 to like until my taxes got too complicated for me to do.

Hannah Maruyama [00:29:07]:
Well, that's what I mean. I did it until then, but I was so long ago. I don't remember what the forms are called.

Ryan Maruyama [00:29:11]:
If you're still using a 10.40 easy, it's, like, pretty simple. Yeah. It's pretty easy, which is why they give you the 10:40 easy.

Hannah Maruyama [00:29:16]:
So that was my bad example.

Ryan Maruyama [00:29:18]:
Some of the No, no, no. 10:40 is a good example. That 10:40 is like everybody.

Hannah Maruyama [00:29:21]:
It's not easy.

Ryan Maruyama [00:29:22]:
Is. Yeah. Not necessarily. It can be, but then, yeah, not necessarily. Cause usually there's a bunch of schedules behind it that you have to put.

Hannah Maruyama [00:29:29]:
It's a 10:40 RC, which is really complicated. Yeah. Thank you. I just made a tax joke.

Ryan Maruyama [00:29:34]:
Yeah. I wanted to hone in on that. Cause like I've had that same conversation. I feel guilty and it's like, well, why do you feel guilty? Like it doesn't make sense. You get paid for your job and I get paid for my job. This is our job. Our job is to make this stuff really, really simple and present it in a very simple way. Exactly what you're talking about with CPA.

Ryan Maruyama [00:29:56]:
What does a CPA do? They present something that's very, very complicated in a very simple way. And it's so simple that all it says on the summary sheet when you get your taxes done by the CPA is that this is how much you owe. This is how much you get back. That's it. And you're like, okay. Got it. And then there's a 100 pages behind it depending on how complicated your taxes are. And you you flip through it, you leaf through it, and you're just like, alright.

Ryan Maruyama [00:30:24]:
Whatever you say, dog. Whatever you say. Yeah. And in the same vein, I don't feel guilty when I see my CPA. Oh, I don't understand any of this. Don't feel guilty about that. Like that's not my job. My job is to do my job.

Hannah Maruyama [00:30:39]:

Ryan Maruyama [00:30:40]:
And you know, it's interesting that parents feel this way because I think they feel like they're failing their child. They feel like they're failing their child. Like, man, I'm not equipped enough to do this with them. Like I'm not a good parent because I don't know like, wow, you guys are like really good at this stuff. And you guys understand this stuff at a deep level and you understand how to get my child's life goals out of them. And then you understand how to find jobs that fit those life goals. And then you understand how to help them find learning opportunities to learn the skills, to get those jobs. And it's like, man, I'm like a failure for not knowing that.

Ryan Maruyama [00:31:18]:
And it's like, no, you're not a failure for not knowing that. Like you're busy, whatever your job is. That's what you do.

Hannah Maruyama [00:31:25]:
Yes. Well, the parents' job is the decision. The parent's job is the final decision with their child and only the parent can do that.

Ryan Maruyama [00:31:32]:
That's erroneous though, too. That's not the final decision because not only the parent could do that, but the young adult can do that too.

Hannah Maruyama [00:31:38]:
I mean, but as a family, like the family's job is to make the final decision about what they're going to do. It's our job to give them all of the very simple information to go. All right, here are your 3 options. And then they decide from there. So for parents, your parenting toolset is there, but don't feel bad that you don't have the skillset to go out and do what we're doing because you have the skillset to go out and do your work. That's what you have to do. And that's why you have that skillset instead of this

Ryan Maruyama [00:32:04]:
one. Exactly. And it goes back to the book that's coming out our workbook check that's coming out. And I'd said it, I think it last week on last week's episode or the week before it, the book is definitely going to help. It is definitely, definitely going to help in all these things. The problem is it's going to take a long time.

Hannah Maruyama [00:32:19]:
That's what we keep sitting and reviewing it and just going, wow, this is going to take forever.

Ryan Maruyama [00:32:23]:
Obviously it took forever for us to write it and then to compile it and to get it out to you folks. But really it's going to take a lot of time for you to go through it because if you're not a professional and doing it, and if you don't do it every day, like it's going to take you forever, which is normal. I mean, that's just to be expected.

Hannah Maruyama [00:32:38]:
With anything that you have to now learn how to do.

Ryan Maruyama [00:32:40]:
Right. Exactly. It's well worth it to take the time to do it, but just know, don't expect for you to be like great at it right out of the gate.

Hannah Maruyama [00:32:48]:
And don't feel guilty if you're not.

Ryan Maruyama [00:32:49]:
And so for you, like as a parent, I mean, how many kids do you have listening to this? How many kids do you have? Statistics say you probably have 2. I mean, okay. At the upper end, you have 9 kids. If you're listening to this, your oldest kid is probably out of the house already, and you're somewhere in the middle of that. So that means you have, like, 4 more shots at this. Let's just say you have 9 shots at this. By the 9th one, they're gonna be really good or you're gonna be much better than at your first one. But, you know, we have way more than 9 reps in.

Hannah Maruyama [00:33:18]:

Ryan Maruyama [00:33:19]:
And so for parents to think, oh, I'm failing my kid because I don't know this stuff. Looking at the result that we give and be like, man, I wish I knew how to do this stuff. And just to like beating themselves up about it, it doesn't make any sense.

Hannah Maruyama [00:33:31]:
Hate to see that because it's so not helpful them to feel that guilt because it's unproductive. But yeah, if you

Ryan Maruyama [00:33:36]:
want to get the workbook, if you

Hannah Maruyama [00:33:37]:
want to pre order it, degreefree.coforward/otheroptions,

Ryan Maruyama [00:33:43]:
That's gonna teach you at least a part of what we do. It is very, very useful. And so, yeah, degreefree.coforward/otheroptions for that. I think that's a pretty good place to kind of stop and wrap up. With the ChatGPT stuff, guys, with the AI stuff, the biggest thing that you could do right now for your young adult and for you, if you're looking to find another job and to get into different jobs, is to encourage your young adult to use these systems, to use these programs, to use these applications, and for you yourself to use the applications as well. Just get your hands wet against your feet wet. Just play around with it. And like I said, the better your input, the better their output.

Ryan Maruyama [00:34:23]:
And so just be leader focused. Think of yourself as a leader. Think of yourself as the conductor of this train or whatever, however you want to of this conductor of this orchestra, and you are telling it what to do, specifically what to do. So gluten free, whatever, whatever, whatever. I need this menu for this many people. Generally speaking, the bigger your prompt, the better output. That's not always the case, but just for to use broad strokes here, usually. And for those people that don't know where to start with this degree free stuff, with the vocational creativity, with helping their child, with helping your child find different career options, the book and the workbook set that's coming out is going to help you identify 3 options at least that will fit your child's life goals.

Ryan Maruyama [00:35:13]:
And it'll help you identify what their life goals are for 1, which is the most important, which we talk about all the time. Like if we don't have a target, we have nothing to shoot for. And then it backtracks it lets you see how do we think of jobs that fit those goals. If that's interesting to you,, you can go and pre order that now. And that's pretty much it, I think.

Hannah Maruyama [00:35:38]:
Yep. I think that's all.

Ryan Maruyama [00:35:39]:
Until next week, guys. Aloha.

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